Tags: circd, consent, drugs, health, medications, men

Can my DH have my DS circd without my consent?.....

On Health & Drugs & Medications » Men's Health

23,704 words with 37 Comments; publish: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 07:56:00 GMT; (90087.89, « »)

...while we are in the hospital?

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  • 37 Comments
    • I'd suggest being vocal enough that they'd know it was a bad idea from a legal standpoint (nontoxic ink on baby's belly with 'no/circ', a letter from a lawyer, plus telling all the staff on an earlier visit, etc.)

      That's heavy. Good luck with that. Any dh of mine who tried that would end up with a second circ he hadn't planned on.

      #1; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:13:00 GMT
    • In my state the mother has to consent but I'm not sure about were you live.

      I would put that you aren't circing in your birth plan and make sure it's written in your chart. Then I would tell every person who your baby will come in contact w/ he is not being circed. I would also not let your baby leave your sight. I would also get a onsie and write do not circ on it, you can do that on his diapers too.

      #2; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:15:00 GMT
    • I would also get a onsie and write do not circ on it, you can do that on his diapers too.

      That is a great idea, I remember that I had to consent myself. It seemed liked a lot of nurses and my doctor asked me if I was going to, so I think that the hospitals are trying to cover their bottoms :moon so that should help.

      Good Luck knowerofnada!

      #3; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:16:00 GMT
    • At my hospital, DH couldn't consent to anything. I had a c-section and DS was in the special care nursery and DH had to keep running back and forth asking me if they could do stuff. I know DH was a bit offended that he had no rights. But, at least, I knew DS would remain intact!! (DH is scared enough of me to not circ behind my back, but he REALLY wanted DS cut)
      #4; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:17:00 GMT
    • In my state the mother has to consent but I'm not sure about were you live.

      I would put that you aren't circing in your birth plan and make sure it's written in your chart. Then I would tell every person who your baby will come in contact w/ he is not being circed. I would also not let your baby leave your sight. I would also get a onsie and write do not circ on it, you can do that on his diapers too.

      Good idea, but I'd use a side snap t-shirt b/c the nurse might object to a onesie (it rubs against the stump from the umbilical cord.)

      #5; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:18:00 GMT
    • Most states only the mom can sign the concent. But just to be on the safe side never allow the baby to go to the nursery without you or someone you trust other than your dh if you are worried.

      While filling out any paper work write in big bold letters across the top "I DO NOT concent to circumcion" on every single page no matter what the paper is for. We have had a few go that route and I personally think it is a great idea.

      The idea of writing on clothing and diapers is a great idea since accidents do happen and the wrong baby gets circed. Make sure that everyone knows from the start you are not circing in case something happens were you are out of it and cannot talk after the birth (c/s with GA for example)

      Make sure every nurse that enters your room knows your child is not to be circed. Tell your OB your feelings as well. Put a sign on the door a big one saying "NO CIRCUMCION" If anyone gives you a hard time tell them you will be more than happy to give them your lawyers phone number so they can explain to him why they are soliciting for a cosmetic only proceedur.

      After you leave the hospital things change tho. Your dh can take the baby to any ped. and have it done without your concent.

      #6; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:19:00 GMT
    • Thank you for the responses.

      I am such an emotional wreck.

      I WILL NOT let it happen. How we are going to get through this, though, I am just at a loss for...

      Why do men care so much about their sons "looking like them"? What is the psychology behind it? Anyone?

      And how do you get a man who refuses to read or listen to anything on the subject to gain some kind of understanding that this is such a cruel and unnecessary procedure?

      DH has agreed to everything else I have fought for regarding our child-rearing with DD - non-vax, extended breastfeeding, organic food, co-sleeping (in theory)...but this seems untouchable. My heart is heavy that we disagree so strongly on this. :gloomy:

      #7; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:20:00 GMT
    • I would explain to him that when he can come up with a legitimate reason to mutilate his son you'll discuss it.

      Since there is no legit reason to ever do it, he won;t be able to come up with one.

      BTW..."cause I wanna" doesn't qualify as legit, neither does cause I want him to look like me...if that's the case, tell him that he is welcome to restore his foreskin so they will look alike.

      Until then, it's just simply non negotiable.

      #8; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:21:00 GMT
    • Dear Julie,

      I'm sorry you are in such a difficult position. I hope it gets easier as time goes by.

      Sometimes, if a guy just doesn't want to hear it, the best thing to do is just drop it. You can't be fighting about this for 8 more months. I was in a similar situation, and I just decided in my heart that it would not happen, but that I wasn't going to discuss it anymore with my dh. It's unlikely that he'll bring it up himself; it's not a topic that circumcised men enjoy discussing. If it does come up, you can say, with a note of finality, "It's not going to happen. I consider it sexual abuse, and I'm not going to let anyone sexually abuse my child." If he persists, you can say, "Look. It's not your penis. It's his penis, and he's the one that gets to decide. Not me, not you. Him."

      Sometimes it becomes less of an issue for them after the child is born. Not many men who have just witnessed their women give birth are willing to challenge her on issues like this.

      Good luck. I don't think they can do it without your consent.

      #9; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:22:00 GMT
    • After you leave the hospital things change tho. Your dh can take the baby to any ped. and have it done without your concent.

      Is this true? I mean I know that a dad physically can as I would assume most Peds wouldn't think to have to ask the mom. But legally don't BOTH parents have to concent once the baby is out of the hospital? I thought I read that somewhere?

      I would also contact your Peds office and let them know (once the baby is born and had a file) that you DO NOT concent to your son being circ, and if they try to have it done you will sue them. Have a professional letter written up, signed and notarized. Though most dads will not go that far.

      ETA Our hospital is the same way, my DH had no rights whatsoever. I had to concent to everything.

      #10; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:23:00 GMT
    • Why do men care so much about their sons "looking like them"? What is the psychology behind it? Anyone?

      This is such a ridiculous argument. Ask him if he's going to be passing around photos saying "And, look! Isn't that just too cute? He has my PENIS!!!!!" or if he'd want you sharing pictures with friends, relatives, co-workers saying "I'm so thrilled, his penis looks just like his daddy's!!!" :dizzy:

      #11; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:24:00 GMT
    • I agree with a pp. Clearly HE wants to match. Perhaps next time he starts, you should say that if he wants them to match, HE should restore his foreskin, and by the time your son is old enough to even notice, he will be finished. You also say that you'd prefer him whole too as you've heard that natural penises are better from a woman's point of view (although that's probably not very tactful and will upset him - but it would probably shut him up).

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      #12; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:25:00 GMT
    • Why do men care so much about their sons "looking like them"? What is the psychology behind it? Anyone?

      I don't think it's an exclusively men's thing. I've read that in areas of the world where girls are circ'ed, mothers often want their daughters cut so they'll "look the same" just like men do here with their sons.

      Best of luck to you.

      #13; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:26:00 GMT
    • Here is an article for YOU to read (NOT to show your dh):

      http://www.stopcirc.com/vincent/vulnerability_of_men.html

      #14; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:27:00 GMT
    • He couldn't at the hospital (though double-check with the staff there beforehand...) as long as you make it KNOWN that you do not want your son circumcised - especially if you live in a high-circumcision-rate area. It's AFTERWARDS you need to be careful about... you need to make sure that your ped knows that your son is to remain intact and if your dh is really adamant you may need to go to court to make sure that he cannot make any decisions about circumcision without your consent.

      Best wishes!

      love and peace. :love

      #15; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:28:00 GMT
    • Here is an article for YOU to read (NOT to show your dh):

      http://www.stopcirc.com/vincent/vulnerability_of_men.html

      That was a good article.

      #16; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:29:00 GMT
    • Thanks, thanks, and more thanks. Everything has been so helpful. The article "The Vulnerability of Men" was esp. helpful!
      #17; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:30:00 GMT
    • Why do men care so much about their sons "looking like them"? What is the psychology behind it? Anyone?

      Is he going to get hair transplants on the baby's privates too, or is your dh bald there? What about chest hair and facial hair? Transplants for that too?

      #18; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:31:00 GMT
    • Is this true? I mean I know that a dad physically can as I would assume most Peds wouldn't think to have to ask the mom. But legally don't BOTH parents have to concent once the baby is out of the hospital? I thought I read that somewhere?

      Both parents don't have to consent to anything else, otherwise every single baby that went for a WBV and got a vax would have to have both parents be present, and I don't think that happens very often.

      #19; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:32:00 GMT
    • if you can get your dh to watch this it may just change his mind on wanting to circ your son.

      http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6584757516627632617&q=circumcision&hl=en

      good luck with everything.

      #20; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:33:00 GMT
    • The video had me sobbing uncontrollably. Adrenealine pumping through my body, heart in the pit of my stomach. I am so ANGRY that anyone would choose to do this to an innocent child. I forwarded him the video. I pray he watches it, but he won't even watch ER because he has such a weak stomach -- isn't it disgustingly ironic??
      #21; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:34:00 GMT
    • Tell him if he can't watch it, just listen.
      #22; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:35:00 GMT
    • Is this true? I mean I know that a dad physically can as I would assume most Peds wouldn't think to have to ask the mom. But legally don't BOTH parents have to consent once the baby is out of the hospital? I thought I read that somewhere?

      All the dad has to do is take the baby in and sign the paper. If asked about the mother he just can say she is still recovering or whatever.

      I have always taken the kids in for wbc and such but some dad's are the main ones to go. I was never asked for proof that my kids were mine not sure if the father would be asked to provide proof either. He can sign for circ just like he could sign for vax or any other procedure.

      I am sharing the following story not to scare you but to let you know what can happen. A mom was against circ the dad wanted it because of the reasons you mentioned. The woman had the baby and the dh didn't bring up circ at the hospital. The mom thought all was well and her dh was going to let it go.

      A week after the baby came home the mom got a strange letter in the mail. It was from a Ped's office she had never dealt with before. She opened the letter and inside was the consent to circ form.

      She confronted her dh and it came out that he had his mom to call the ped's office and have the forms sent before the date the mil scheduled for the circ.

      They were going to take the baby on the pretext of giving the mom a rest and have it done without her knowing till it was over. :crying

      The mom threatened to walk out right then and finally her dh backed down when he saw how serious this was to her.

      Just imagine what would have happened had the mil not made a mistake and had the papers sent to the wrong address. I get sick thinking about this story and I will never forget it.

      So keep this in mind and if your dh isn't on board make sure to never let the baby alone with him. :(

      #23; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:36:00 GMT
    • Tell him if he can't watch it, just listen.

      Tell him if he can't watch it he just lost the argument.:lol I mean come on, he can't watch a video of it but he wants to do it to his son?!?

      #24; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:37:00 GMT
    • Tell him if he can't watch it he just lost the argument.:lol I mean come on, he can't watch a video of it but he wants to do it to his son?!?

      :yeah: Seriously...

      love and peace. :love

      #25; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:38:00 GMT
    • They were going to take the baby on the pretext of giving the mom a rest and have it done without her knowing till it was over. :crying

      The mom threatened to walk out right then and finally her dh backed down when he saw how serious this was to her.

      Just imagine what would have happened had the mil not made a mistake and had the papers sent to the wrong address. I get sick thinking about this story and I will never forget it.

      So keep this in mind and if your dh isn't on board make sure to never let the baby alone with him. :(

      That would finish me. A marriage is supposed to be built on trust, if he is prepared to take a child and mutilate it behind my back knowing how I feel about it, I'd never trust him again - what else is he likely to do?

      Not only would there be no more children, there would be no more marriage - how can you have a marriage if you don't trust your husband enough to leave his own children with him?

      #26; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:39:00 GMT
    • That would finish me. A marriage is supposed to be built on trust, if he is prepared to take a child and mutilate it behind my back knowing how I feel about it, I'd never trust him again - what else is he likely to do?

      Not only would there be no more children, there would be no more marriage - how can you have a marriage if you don't trust your husband enough to leave his own children with him?

      I feel the same way. :( How anyone could be that set against causing harm to a human being is beyond me.

      #27; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:40:00 GMT
    • All the dad has to do is take the baby in and sign the paper. If asked about the mother he just can say she is still recovering or whatever.

      I have always taken the kids in for wbc and such but some dad's are the main ones to go. I was never asked for proof that my kids were mine not sure if the father would be asked to provide proof either. He can sign for circ just like he could sign for vax or any other procedure.

      I am sharing the following story not to scare you but to let you know what can happen. A mom was against circ the dad wanted it because of the reasons you mentioned. The woman had the baby and the dh didn't bring up circ at the hospital. The mom thought all was well and her dh was going to let it go.

      A week after the baby came home the mom got a strange letter in the mail. It was from a Ped's office she had never dealt with before. She opened the letter and inside was the consent to circ form.

      She confronted her dh and it came out that he had his mom to call the ped's office and have the forms sent before the date the mil scheduled for the circ.

      They were going to take the baby on the pretext of giving the mom a rest and have it done without her knowing till it was over. :crying

      The mom threatened to walk out right then and finally her dh backed down when he saw how serious this was to her.

      Just imagine what would have happened had the mil not made a mistake and had the papers sent to the wrong address. I get sick thinking about this story and I will never forget it.

      So keep this in mind and if your dh isn't on board make sure to never let the baby alone with him. :(

      I remember this story, too. And I remember really, really hating the MIL in this story. (It reminds me of how back-stabbing my own MIL can be.)

      Back to the original poster: If it comes down to it, you could always leave your dh off the birth certificate and tell everyone you don't know who the father is, so anyone claiming to be the father shouldn't have any rights to anything. I hope it doesn't come to that, though.

      #28; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:41:00 GMT
    • Tell him if he can't watch it he just lost the argument.:lol I mean come on, he can't watch a video of it but he wants to do it to his son?!?

      :yeah:

      #29; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:42:00 GMT
    • Back to the original poster: If it comes down to it, you could always leave your dh off the birth certificate and tell everyone you don't know who the father is, so anyone claiming to be the father shouldn't have any rights to anything. I hope it doesn't come to that, though.

      Unfortunately in most states (if not all) if you're married the husband is automatically legally the father (even if he's not and you both say he's not) until you go to court and go in front of a judge and go through a bunch of crap to get him off the certificate.

      #30; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:43:00 GMT
    • Back to the original poster: If it comes down to it, you could always leave your dh off the birth certificate and tell everyone you don't know who the father is, so anyone claiming to be the father shouldn't have any rights to anything. I hope it doesn't come to that, though.

      Yeah, no. That's absolutely absurd.

      DH will come around, I feel fairly confident about that after he agreed to read the sticky thread "If you circ'd your son and have regrets, please post here"...I also told him I forwarded him the circ video and he didn't say he wouldn't watch it, so this is huge progress.

      I am confident that even if he continues to push for this, once we are out of the hospital situation, he will let it go.

      #31; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:44:00 GMT
    • I don't believe so. I think only the Mother can sign consent forms and such post hospital birth, unless you are unconscious, etc...You would have to check with your hospital to find out for sure.

      You can go to www.mothersagainstcirc.com (http://www.mothersagainstcirc.com)and print off a NO CIRC form to give to your Dr.

      If your husband is threatening to circ your son against your will and he will not research the subject, personaly, it would be "INTACT or DIVORCED."

      Blessed Be,

      Lauren

      #32; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:45:00 GMT
    • Yeah, no. That's absolutely absurd.

      DH will come around, I feel fairly confident about that after he agreed to read the sticky thread "If you circ'd your son and have regrets, please post here"...I also told him I forwarded him the circ video and he didn't say he wouldn't watch it, so this is huge progress.

      I am confident that even if he continues to push for this, once we are out of the hospital situation, he will let it go.

      My ex and I were planning on circ'ing our first until a month before the baby was born. *I* was the one who changed "the plan"!! My ex was going to go along with me because I felt strongly about it, but finally was convinced himself when we interviewed our pediatrician and I asked her view on circ and she said its not medically necessary. That was all it took- he felt "okay" about it after that. (That's a bit different than your situation, though, since there weren't many weeks between my change of mine and his.) Over the 9+ years we've had boys (Turned 9 and 5 this past Fall), he has told people that the "matching" thing is rediculous. So far, I haven't heard about any issues from school either. Of course, my boys knows what circ is in a basic way, so...

      #33; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:46:00 GMT
    • Why do men care so much about their sons "looking like them"? What is the psychology behind it? Anyone?

      IF that is your husbands reasoning...so that they will look the same, then tell your husband he should start restoring his own foreskin. THEN they will look the same!

      Blessed Be,

      Lauren

      #34; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:47:00 GMT
    • === Original Words ===

      knowerofnada

      Why do men care so much about their sons "looking like them"? What is the psychology behind it? Anyone?

      Here's as brief history of the "Look like dad" phenomenon:

      http://www.circumcisionquotes.com/index3.html

      #35; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:48:00 GMT
    • The video had me sobbing uncontrollably. Adrenealine pumping through my body, heart in the pit of my stomach. I am so ANGRY that anyone would choose to do this to an innocent child. I forwarded him the video. I pray he watches it, but he won't even watch ER because he has such a weak stomach -- isn't it disgustingly ironic??

      There are other videos out there. I have a collection of various online versions here (http://www.circumcisionquotes.com/video.html) if you'd like.

      #36; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:49:00 GMT
    • I don't think so. It's because the heredity is not yet proven. They KNOW the child is related to you biologically, because he came out of your vagina. For all they know, though, he could be the result of a secret affair or something else. I think it's the policy that the mother makes the choices in the hospital.
      #37; Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:50:00 GMT